Any Thoughts about Way of Life Literature?

#1
Other than the "Way of Life Encyclopedia of the Bible and Christianity Things Hard to be Understood" which can be purchased as a SS module, does anyone have any thoughts to share about Way of Life Literature? I'm particularly interested to know what others may think of the bible study series.

Thank you
Ken
 
#2
Other than the "Way of Life Encyclopedia of the Bible and Christianity Things Hard to be Understood" which can be purchased as a SS module, does anyone have any thoughts to share about Way of Life Literature? I'm particularly interested to know what others may think of the bible study series.

Thank you
Ken
I am not always on the same doctrinal pages as he (David Cloud) anymore. But today's (about) Facebook article ➡️ looks on target 🎯. https://www.wayoflife.org/

I own all of the above and more. I have his whole digital library (old version) of pdf's. Many DVD's CD's and paid downloaded videos... Accidentally obtained rough drafts of certain doctrinal topic notes. Stuff, bunch of stuff.

I am convinced that every man's opinion is full of inconsistencies, including my own. For this reason my goal is to seek answers in Bible study using as little opinion as possible. I rarely use this COPYRIGHT material from Way Of Life Ministry anymore, and when I do it's usually only for objective comparison. The doctrines I hold today differ from some I held.

On his subject of "how to" study the Bible, I gleaned some valuable marking tips and encouragement to *build personal cross-references... A SwordSearcher user commentary works for that *purpose 😁 (but it would be neat to 🔌start with a user editable template of xrefs from TSK or other) - - - it's where and when I finally became totally convinced and convicted the best Bible study is comparing scripture with scripture. (I never did look at the SwordSearcher included imhStudy module on this topic but might now)

I keep WOLE (Way of Life Encyclopedia) in my Bible margin links still, but rarely use it; yet I don't keep any other similar there to replace it, because the author is not a Bible agnostic. Even more rarely will I investigate THTBU (Things Hard To be Understood) but sometimes. - - - again xrefs most often resolve...

I keep it cuz I paid for it, but wouldn't dig through ashes to recover it from a fire, like I would have with the stock SwordSearcher program, if my meaning makes sense. In clarity... I prefer comparing scripture with scripture.
 
#3
I agree totally that one shouldn't rely too much on the writings/opinions of men but must recognize that there is much to consider in what others have gleaned out of their bible study. Clearly it all must be filtered through God's words. Based on what you've shared I don't think I'll spend $150 for the complete bible study series offered on their site. It would actually be presumptuous to by the entire set without first purchasing an individual study first anyway. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
 
#4
I haven't looked into the latest WoL offerings yet, but if you get a single study; Bible version issue ask if you can get it in plain text so you can at least put it in SwordSearcher (if that is where you want to reference them) .

Messing around trying to convert these PDF's to text can be sloppy without full version Pro PDF software like Adobe Acrobat DC or similar.

They had it set up where you can search the whole stack of PDF's, but it's (was at least) quite cumbersome. COPYRIGHT protection issues prevented that option of plain text document in the past but maybe things changed?
 
#5
This is from the Way of Life website concerning changes to the KJV since 1611:

First, we see that the KJV has gone through such a strenuous purification process that the reader can have complete confidence in its accuracy.

Second, the difference between the 1611 KJV and today’s KJV is extremely minor. Though there are “thousands” of differences, these are largely inconsequential.

Third, any idea that the KJV was “given by inspiration” is disproved. If it were “given by inspiration” in 1611 it would not have needed any sort of correction or refinement, because it would have been infallible in every detail. Those who teach that the KJV is more than an excellent and accurate translation, that it is given by inspiration and perfect and inerrant in itself and advanced revelation and such, must show us exactly which edition they are referring to.

https://www.wayoflife.org/reports/changes_to_kjv_since_1611.html
 

Brandon Staggs

Administrator
Staff member
#6
Those who teach that the KJV is more than an excellent and accurate translation, that it is given by inspiration and perfect and inerrant in itself and advanced revelation and such, must show us exactly which edition they are referring to.
An interesting standard.

2 Timothy 3:15-16 (KJV) And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

If it's not given by inspiration, it's not Scripture.
 

Johnny NL

Active Member
#7
An interesting standard.

2 Timothy 3:15-16 (KJV) And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

If it's not given by inspiration, it's not Scripture.
AMEN, ... AMEN..... AND A M E N ! ! !
 

Johnny NL

Active Member
#8
And , ... Rightly Dividing...

2Timothy 2:15 Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.

2TIMOTHY215.JPG


Dispensation....
Amen.
 
#11
Type setting errors of early KJB prints were made under sometimes poorly lit work conditions, by typesetters that were sometimes less than sober. They were under pressure to meet deadlines and other factors. Remember that each letter was hand placed.

However:
“… List of wrong readings of the Bible of 1611 amended in later editions.” Scrivener also analyzed the KJV’s underlying Greek text”... (found@ link provided by Timothy above)

Hmlss maintains prejudice against the *Scrivener text as spurious and doubt building—an accepted *textual critic by some who are not consistent in their opinion of the KJV. (SwordSearcher does Not use Scrivener text 😁.) https://av1611.com/kjbp/kjv-edition.html

Speaking of textual critics that bring you “a fresh translation today”… They rely on broken vessels to help them figure out what word goes where IF it’s even the right word… cuz they don’t know for sure. And their broken vessels are still broken - - NA28 now. (version 28) presto chango🙄 another round of revisions are revised and devised $$$...

Since 1881 and the birth of the CT, then the mistake hiding perpetuates with NA1 in 1898.

Bringing you to; (quote edited for highlight purpose)
“The text of the 26th edition of the Nestle-Aland was adopted for the 27th edition also, while the apparatus underwent an extensive revision..... then the situation has changed, because the Editio Critica Maior (ECM) of the Catholic Letters is now available…. The ECM text was adopted for the present edition following approval by the editorial committee of the Nestle-Aland and the GNT.”
http://www.nestle-aland.com/en/history/
Yep… 🎶still changin’ after all these years…

21 My son, fear thou the LORD and the king: and meddle not with them that are given to change: — Pro 24:21 KJB
17 Every good gift and every perfect gift is from above, and cometh down from the Father of lights, with whom is no variableness, neither shadow of turning. — Jas 1:17 KJB
 
#12
To evaluate all other material from Way of Life Literature one must understand his position of our final authority.

May I recommend downloading his free 468 page ebook to help with your decision. I would also recommend doing a word search for "inspired" in this document. (.pdf)

Free ebook series - Why We Hold to the King James Bible
https://www.wayoflife.org/free_ebooks/why_we_hold_to_the_king_james_bible.php

page 442
question 8. Is the King James Bible Inspired (explained more in detail)
 
#13
To evaluate all other material from Way of Life Literature one must understand his position of our final authority.

May I recommend downloading his free 468 page ebook to help with your decision. I would also recommend doing a word search for "inspired" in this document. (.pdf)

Free ebook series - Why We Hold to the King James Bible
https://www.wayoflife.org/free_ebooks/why_we_hold_to_the_king_james_bible.php

page 442
question 8. Is the King James Bible Inspired (explained more in detail)
Yes Cloud denies that the KJB is inspired. In my mind that places him squarely in the "OAO" camp... Only the original autographs were inspired.

Cloud's confusion add to others like him that create a confusion pool that is tough to navigate. These "tools" I keep tucked away in the toolbox of tools that God allowed me to be hammered on for years while He(God) showed me why I should not trust the opinion of man.

Here is a plate of balance cookies to help explain "OAO".

 
#14
In considering whether you would use Way of Life literature I would also read his statement of faith.

https://www.wayoflife.org/about/statement.html

He is very serious about separation and I believe it is a major theme of his material.

SEPARATION FROM THE WORLD
We believe the Bible also requires strict separation from the evil things of the world

SEPARATION FROM HERESY AND APOSTASY
We believe that the Bible requires separation from all forms of heresy and ecclesiastical apostasy (Rom. 16:17; 2 Cor. 6:14-18; 1 Thess. 3:6; 1 Tim. 6:3-5; 2 Tim. 3:5; Titus 3:10-11; 2 John 10-11; Rev. 18:4). We are commanded to try them, mark them, rebuke them, have no fellowship with them, withdraw ourselves, receive them not, have no company with them, reject them, and separate ourselves from them.

With all this being said. I own several of his Advanced Bible Study Series and would recommend them. They are thorough and comprehensive and as he stated on his website: "They are based strictly upon the King James Bible and the powerful word studies assist in the understanding of the KJV but never cast doubt upon it."
 
#16
I agree a Statement of Faith is one area to examine in any Ministry or Church. I've read hundreds of them. On blogs, personal sites, Church sites, Ministry sites, Twitter, forums, hard copies from pastors, and so on.

But I found something that speaks louder than some Ministries statement of faith. How do they respond when demonstrated that their behavior is inconsistent with their statement.?

Mat 7:16 KJB Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles?

Something I try hard not to repeat when my own inconsistencies are manifested, follows... However I have seen it in bucket loads and do know what it looks like ✔️

Pro 21:24 KJB Proud and haughty scorner is his name, who dealeth in proud wrath.
 
#17
An interesting standard.

2 Timothy 3:15-16 (KJV) And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus. All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:

If it's not given by inspiration, it's not Scripture.

Not intending to fork a new conversation, but merely to help those interested in learning a more detailed writing of David Cloud's position of "whether the KJV was given by inspiration"

I will provide this link: https://www.wayoflife.org/database/king_james_only.html

Also, the following David Cloud Statements in Way of Life literature.

The Problem With New Age Bible Versions
Updated January 3, 2008 (first published in O Timothy magazine, Vol. 11, Issue 8, 1994)

Does this mean I believe the KJV is in some sense insufficient. No, I believe 2 Timothy 3:16-17 refers not only to the original giving of the Scriptures but to the fact that the copies and translations are inspired, as well, as long as they are accurate. Obviously Timothy did not have the original manuscripts which came from the hands of the Bible writers. I believe therefore that the King James Bible is the inspired Word of God in the English language.

“I believe the King James Bible is an accurate and lovely translation of the preserved Greek and Hebrew text of Scripture. I do not believe the King James Bible contains any errors. I believe that God had His hand upon the KJV in a special way because of the singular role it would play in the transmission of the Word of God during a long and crucial epoch of church history. In contrast with the modern English versions, I believe the KJV is based upon a superior underlying text; it was produced by superior translators; it incorporates superior translation techniques; it demonstrates a superior theology; it embodies a superior English; it was created in a superior era; and it has a superior history. I believe the King James Bible is the inspired Word of God because it accurately translates the inspired text.”
 

Johnny NL

Active Member
#18
Timothy....
AMEN, AMEN, and AMEN.....!!!!!!!!!!
 

Brandon Staggs

Administrator
Staff member
#19
I appreciate your post, @timothy. For clarity, my own comments weren't meant to be a criticism of David Cloud or his material. I have read a lot of his material and I have worked with him and his staff to make some of it available to SwordSearcher users (via WOL). My comment was meant as a point of clarification on one issue.

I believe when we talk about inspiration of the Bible we should be careful to stick to the Biblical standards. I think it causes confusion to call anything "Holy Scripture" and then try to exclude an intrinsic property of God's word from it-- in this case, the Bible plainly states that all Scripture is given by inspiration of God. The modern Warfieldian concept of "uninspired Scripture" is a mistake -- Warfield's theology that redefined "inspiration" to be a historical act of penmanship has done a lot of damage to faith in God and his word, in my opinion, and I find it lamentable that the default position today is to say that God's word "was inspired" in the past and that there is something no longer available to us today because inspiration was some kind of historical one-off. Anyway. :)
 
#20
In fairness... I does appear that David Clouds statement's on inspiration are confused and contradictory. Much of what he writes about is focused on different audiences, about the same topic, or maybe I should say it like this...

When he is thinking about Peter Ruckman, his statement concerning inspiration sounds carefully formed so that his view should be distinguished as different so that he isn't called a "Ruckmanite"...

https://www.wayoflife.org/database/ruckman.html

This kind of stuff makes the water muddy... But once you get the mud washed off, you will remember how you got muddy.
 
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